Sane

For the longest time I was under the impression that html was not programming at all. HTML is just a series of tags to output a static display. I've noticed many others around this forum seem to think the same thing.

But after actually creating a website, I've noticed that there are indeed a lot of similiarities and have now changed my opinion on HTML. HTML is a lot like programming in the sense where you have an idea formed in your head and you must reach that formidable conclusion. This conclusion can be reached several different ways, and each have their drawbacks in either speed or compatibility. To reach the end result you will also usually need to problem solve in your head, how best to go about the several different methods.

It won't apply the same to using HTML in dream weaver or front page, but in notepad I definitely say html contains the essence of programming.

What is you opinion/argument?

Navid

Programming consists of algorithms with applied logic. Creativity is another factor that also applies with HTML. But I'd say HTML can be easily distinguished as a non-programming language, even though the computer still has to calculate your given attributes. So I guess HTML can be considered partially as programming language.

DaWei

The production of HTML code is not programming, any more than is red-lining text for a printer to work with. Creativity has nothing to do with it. A quite creative person might do an oil portrait -- it's not programming.

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King

I would consider it programming when you use it with Java Scritp... but not so much by itself

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DaWei

Javascript is a programming language. Using HTML in the same room doesn't make it a programming language. My grandson 'paints' on my computer. It doesn't make him a programmer. If you can even conceive of HTML being a programming language, instead of a markup language, you're waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy short of understanding "programming".

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King

I didn't mean HTML was a programming, I was just saying JS and HTML usually go hand and hand... I worded that wong. HTML is just a way to put things on the screen in a web browser, you can use JS to add some logic to it.

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Sane

DaWei, if that was directed at me, I wouldn't go as far as saying I'm "waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy" short of understanding programming. :/

DaWei

It was directed at anyone who interprets the generation of HTML as "programming."

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Darkhack

I have to agree with DaWei. That is not to say that HTML isn't a skill or something that doesn't require effort. HTML is very difficult when you start designing complex pages. Getting a page to look just perfect and then to have it look that same way under multiple browsers is very difficult. My opinion is that the reason people want to attach the term "programming" to HTML is because they believe HTML is underrated in its difficulty and that applying the word programming would make it seem more complex. It's just a word and won't make a difference. If people diddle around with Hello World in HTML and think its easy then let them. We all know it can be very complex in the real world. Just because it isn't programming doesn't mean it isn't a worthy talent.

HTML is and always will be a markup language. I'm not going to get into the little gritty details, but think of it this way. A programming language can do math, store variables, move/change data, and a number of other things that HTML simply cannot do. Javascript is a programming language (scripting technically, but lets not go into that either) because it can do all of those things. A programming language's output can be dynamic. HTML is always static unless I combine it with something like Javascript/VBscript/PHP/ASP/JSP. Do keep in mind this is all coming from a guy who does this kind of stuff everyday. In fact, I have Dreamweaver open right now. You'll notice I have PHP listed under my profile but not x/html.

Also to DaWei. He isn't nessisarily "waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy" short of programming knowledge. I thought the idea behind his reasoning was quite interesting in a way. I once read a similar thread on Google Groups where a user talked about programs having only finite possibilities. He mentioned a calculator for example would have a user click a hyperlink on the numbers and operations signs and it would direct you to a different page where the output is displayed. Granted it would require a near infinite number of HTML pages to work since it did not rely on any other scripting. Still an interesting topic though.

DaWei

Your response is very cogent, Darkhack. No where did I intimate that HTML didn't require skill. Web page design is very difficult. Nowhere did I say anyone lacked "programming knowledge." Here is a dead quote:
I stand by that. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, of course. There are those who maintain that the earth is flat and the moon is green cheese. In many countries, they are entitled to do so.

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