DaWei

You tell me all about machine language, son, I'm all ears. Never heard of the silly thang.

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rsnd

machine "language"...yeah
lets see STS inst AVR 16 bit arch
[7b]<- lvl1 ext inst identifier e.g. 1001001
[5b]<- direct Rd addr 00000->
[4b]<- res
[16b]<- SRAM offset

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DaWei

Let me tell you something, boy. I've written 10s of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of lines of assembly language; most in embedded real-time systems that had to run on the bleeding edge, because that's what the customers demand. You've shown yourself to be a fool; were I you, I wouldn't strive to add 'stupid' to that.

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Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers

Harakim

He isn't talking about assembly, he is talking about machine code. That's what EEs do, not CS. Completely different concept.

Ooble

I'm a a newbie to low-level programming, so I may be wrong, but from what I understand, Assembly was created so low-level programmers could avoid writing in "machine language". Using machine language where there is an Assembly language for that device sounds to me like a waste of time.

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Harakim

I was just clarifying that there is a difference. Machine language is voltages and usually hard-wired. It's been somewhat perverted by software people as 1's and 0's, but that's not really a big deal for software people I guess. Example: the machines that you actually had to flip the switches up and down.

Ooble

I'm just curious as to where those numbers in rsnd's post are coming from.

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DaWei

While that may be literally true, that is not how the term is employed. Machine language is the numerical representation of the instructions (opcodes and operands) that direct the operation of the cpu. They are read from memory as binary values. The various parts of the hardware cpu gate them here and there as appropriate, in order that the operations may be properly completed by the hardware. The results are directed appropriately. My God, I can believe that people don't know these things, that's not a biggie. What I have trouble believing is that people that DON'T know these things spout them in front of a bunch of gullible novices as if they are the gospel and to be believed without reservation. I could just puke in my cuffs.

I am, incidentally, an EE. My experience covers hardware design (analog and digital) as well as software design as well as managerial experience ranging up to VP, Engineering for other companies and owner of my own company. That latter means nothing, of course, in the absence of success, but it was successful. While I am an old fogey, I am not stupid. Immature blathering is one thing but guru-like pronunciamentos by unhatched fools is quite another.

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Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers

rsnd

You got upset because I did guru-like pronunciamentos and I am an unhatched fool? Do you have any idea how old I am? Mr. "old fogey?" "400%, minimum, ahead of" me "in the knowledge department..." Disgusted by people you think "DON'T know these things spout them in front of a bunch of gullible novices as if they are the gospel and to be believed without reservation," that you "could just puke in your cuffs."

























I'll be 19 next january. I dont remember saying or trying to imply that I am any superior to any programmers before. Those ideas were forced upon me by individuals who thaught it could be that way. Of course, I only say to the extent I know...which may not be greatly detailed or whatever or may not be "exactly" correct due to my lack of knowledge but you cant convince me not to say them. Because If I dont say them and just keep it within me, i'll never know if what I know is right or wrong. I even said in my first post that this is probably a stupid thing to ask. I always thaught ranting done by immature kids like myself...but for you to jump like that...not something I expected from the wise old DaWei who has always helped me...

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DaWei

You're so upset you think my last statement was triggered by you. It doesn't quote YOU when it starts, and it doesn't refer to you. It refers to some fuzzy statement regarding voltages and logic and provinces of EEs and CSes. Pure twaddle.

I came back at you in the earlier stages because you were evincing beliefs which, in my experience, have a high probability of limiting your effectiveness as a producing coder. Perhaps you have noticed that many of my posts have as much about approaches to the work as they do about the technical foundations. That comes from my background. There is no guarantee that I am correct in my positions or that Narue is correct in hers. Think for yourself, as you do. However, to discard Narue's views, which were rationally explained, while certainly your right, is probably not wise.

I apologize for upsetting you unduly. I hope you go back and review the thread.

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Abstraction doesn't make it impossible to write bad code; it makes it possible to write superior code.
Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers