Programming Forums > Application Development > C++

Infinite Recursion · Jun 5th, 2005, 4:30 AM

I like things the way they are Kyle... which is the reason I've stayed so long. The cussing thing is getting blown out of proportion, to each their own though. If cussing is the only problem we have, we are doing pretty good as a community.

kurifu · Jun 5th, 2005, 7:37 AM

It is a good thing that grammar is not one of the required components to a good message here... lol. How to Post Well is probably better stated as How to Make a Good Post.... I wouldn't even go for How to Post Good, that just sounds funny.

But don't get me wrong, I certainly hope everyone is feeling well too when they post, I am just not sure that the credentials listed in this sticky would really help anyone who is under the weather.

DaWei · Jun 5th, 2005, 8:33 AM

"How to post well" is perfectly good grammar. The adverb is attached directly to the word it's modifying. It doesn't say, "How to post when well (or feeling well)." I cuss. I'm not only a southern USA type (although in NY at the moment), I'm a redneck bubba. The gratuitous overuse in a way that doesn't contribute to the communication is offputting to many people. No thinking person has to ask if it might be offensive to a number of visitors. THERE WOULDN'T BE A FILTER TO CATCH IT IF IT WEREN'T POTENTIALLY OFFENSIVE. Most of the posts calling it in question have been reasoned and rational statements. Take them how you will. Think for yourself. Express yourself, with regard for your audience. If you believe that you have actual freedom of speech (and reside in the USA or a similarly free state), you have no doubt forgotton (or not read) the wording of the Bill of Rights.

Bottom line is: are you attempting to contribute to this forum and its goals and its usefulness to a wide range of people, or are you using it as a l33t hangout to pump up your independence and coolness to a limited and similar group? Do the forum owner a favor: consider that his ads need viewing and clicking by people that can find a place to view and click without having to say, "Oh, kiddie stuff. Wonder why it's not red text on a black background!".

Berto · Jun 6th, 2005, 4:08 AM

I am a programmer i use variable that dont care if they are spelt correctly, I am a mathmatician my mathmatics do not care if i spell them correctly. This is not a How to speak better English forum, my english skills are far from good, but do I care no, if someone thinks that I am stupid for not having good grammer or english so be it. Its up to other to decide.

DaWei · Jun 6th, 2005, 8:21 AM

If English is not your first language, no one should judge you by it (unless they're interviewing you for a job requiring proficiency in English). On the other hand, if you've been working in English since the day you were born, and can't handle it reasonably adequately, why should I trust your mathematics?

It is commonly said one shouldn't judge a book by its cover (make snap judgements). That's a nice truism that isn't accommodated by reality. Suppose you have one job opening and 400 applicants? Will you take a month or so to become personally acquainted with each so that you may judge them fairly? I don't think so. Personally, first thing I do is throw away all the colored resumes, because I know they're identical but for the personal facts. It still leaves a long job ahead. I will judge you by your book's cover.

Infinite Recursion · Jun 6th, 2005, 9:06 AM

"bad english" definitely does NOT denote "bad mathematics"... and the reverse is true also.

In my experience... you are judged by your "cover"... not only the resume, but your deducation, ability and experience in the subject matter.

Berto · Jun 6th, 2005, 9:08 AM

if bad english denotes bad mathmatics then i must be the oddest person in the world just look at my Uni module grades.

DaWei · Jun 6th, 2005, 9:26 AM

You are misunderstanding my point. The use of your English as a yardstick is only applicable if English is your native language. If it is, bad English denotes a lack of application or a lack of discipline in regard to a particular subject. Perhaps you hate that subject and love mathematics. That's your reason. Possibly even justification. If I don't know you, I'm not going to take a chance that you applied discipline in one area, but chose not to in another. Again, this may be construed as unfair. It's the real world. One may attempt to legislate fairness (and societies have), but it's very hard to enforce. Incidentally, if you're an odd person, welcome to the club. I'm odd. Sometimes I insist upon my right to be odd, to my own detriment. One evaluates, one picks and chooses, one gains or pains. I'm 64 and still not fully mature; still wondering what I want to be when I grow up.

Berto · Jun 6th, 2005, 9:58 AM

If english is not your native language yet this forum is to be spoken in english, wouldn't be more benificial to talk in an easier way for them to understand?

And as for my poor english skills i think it stems from the fact of at a young age I grew bored with it, like many things it was jsut another bit of ammunition for those evil kids to bully me over, i was far far ahead of most my class in both engish and maths when i was young (8-11) just stopped reading as much etc etc etc. And you will have a far greater grasp of the english language having a few years on me

big_k105 · Jun 6th, 2005, 11:09 AM

Do we really need to be discussing proper english here? I mean I personally understand the need for atleast good communication skills esp in the interview. As i have blown many interviews because i get nervious which in case i dont speak very well when im nervious. Not that im the best at proper english but im not the worst either. So again do we need to be discussing this here?

Jun 5th, 2005, 4:30 AM	#41
Infinite Recursion Programming Guru Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3,475 Rep Power: 8	I like things the way they are Kyle... which is the reason I've stayed so long. The cussing thing is getting blown out of proportion, to each their own though. If cussing is the only problem we have, we are doing pretty good as a community. __________________ http://jasonpowers.net "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root."

Jun 5th, 2005, 7:37 AM	#42
kurifu Expert Programmer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia (Canada) Posts: 784 Rep Power: 5	It is a good thing that grammar is not one of the required components to a good message here... lol. How to Post Well is probably better stated as How to Make a Good Post.... I wouldn't even go for How to Post Good, that just sounds funny. But don't get me wrong, I certainly hope everyone is feeling well too when they post, I am just not sure that the credentials listed in this sticky would really help anyone who is under the weather. __________________ Clifford Matthew Roche <geek@cliffordroche.com> Web Hosting: http://www.crd-hosting.com Consulting: http://www.crdev-consulting.com

Jun 5th, 2005, 8:33 AM	#43
DaWei Resident Grouch Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,453 Rep Power: 10	"How to post well" is perfectly good grammar. The adverb is attached directly to the word it's modifying. It doesn't say, "How to post when well (or feeling well)." I cuss. I'm not only a southern USA type (although in NY at the moment), I'm a redneck bubba. The gratuitous overuse in a way that doesn't contribute to the communication is offputting to many people. No thinking person has to ask if it might be offensive to a number of visitors. THERE WOULDN'T BE A FILTER TO CATCH IT IF IT WEREN'T POTENTIALLY OFFENSIVE. Most of the posts calling it in question have been reasoned and rational statements. Take them how you will. Think for yourself. Express yourself, with regard for your audience. If you believe that you have actual freedom of speech (and reside in the USA or a similarly free state), you have no doubt forgotton (or not read) the wording of the Bill of Rights. Bottom line is: are you attempting to contribute to this forum and its goals and its usefulness to a wide range of people, or are you using it as a l33t hangout to pump up your independence and coolness to a limited and similar group? Do the forum owner a favor: consider that his ads need viewing and clicking by people that can find a place to view and click without having to say, "Oh, kiddie stuff. Wonder why it's not red text on a black background!". __________________ Abstraction doesn't make it impossible to write bad code; it makes it possible to write superior code. Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers

Jun 6th, 2005, 4:08 AM	#44
Berto Programming Guru Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,022 Rep Power: 6	I am a programmer i use variable that dont care if they are spelt correctly, I am a mathmatician my mathmatics do not care if i spell them correctly. This is not a How to speak better English forum, my english skills are far from good, but do I care no, if someone thinks that I am stupid for not having good grammer or english so be it. Its up to other to decide. __________________ "Put your hand on a hot stove for a minute, and it seems like an hour. Sit with a pretty girl for an hour, and it seems like a minute. THAT'S relativity." - Albert Einstein

Jun 6th, 2005, 8:21 AM	#45
DaWei Resident Grouch Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,453 Rep Power: 10	If English is not your first language, no one should judge you by it (unless they're interviewing you for a job requiring proficiency in English). On the other hand, if you've been working in English since the day you were born, and can't handle it reasonably adequately, why should I trust your mathematics? It is commonly said one shouldn't judge a book by its cover (make snap judgements). That's a nice truism that isn't accommodated by reality. Suppose you have one job opening and 400 applicants? Will you take a month or so to become personally acquainted with each so that you may judge them fairly? I don't think so. Personally, first thing I do is throw away all the colored resumes, because I know they're identical but for the personal facts. It still leaves a long job ahead. I will judge you by your book's cover. __________________ Abstraction doesn't make it impossible to write bad code; it makes it possible to write superior code. Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers

Jun 6th, 2005, 9:06 AM	#46
Infinite Recursion Programming Guru Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3,475 Rep Power: 8	"bad english" definitely does NOT denote "bad mathematics"... and the reverse is true also. In my experience... you are judged by your "cover"... not only the resume, but your deducation, ability and experience in the subject matter. __________________ http://jasonpowers.net "There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root."

Jun 6th, 2005, 9:08 AM	#47
Berto Programming Guru Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,022 Rep Power: 6	if bad english denotes bad mathmatics then i must be the oddest person in the world just look at my Uni module grades. __________________ "Put your hand on a hot stove for a minute, and it seems like an hour. Sit with a pretty girl for an hour, and it seems like a minute. THAT'S relativity." - Albert Einstein

Jun 6th, 2005, 9:26 AM	#48
DaWei Resident Grouch Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,453 Rep Power: 10	You are misunderstanding my point. The use of your English as a yardstick is only applicable if English is your native language. If it is, bad English denotes a lack of application or a lack of discipline in regard to a particular subject. Perhaps you hate that subject and love mathematics. That's your reason. Possibly even justification. If I don't know you, I'm not going to take a chance that you applied discipline in one area, but chose not to in another. Again, this may be construed as unfair. It's the real world. One may attempt to legislate fairness (and societies have), but it's very hard to enforce. Incidentally, if you're an odd person, welcome to the club. I'm odd. Sometimes I insist upon my right to be odd, to my own detriment. One evaluates, one picks and chooses, one gains or pains. I'm 64 and still not fully mature; still wondering what I want to be when I grow up. __________________ Abstraction doesn't make it impossible to write bad code; it makes it possible to write superior code. Contributor's Corner: Grumpy on C++ Exceptions DaWei on Pointers

Jun 6th, 2005, 9:58 AM	#49
Berto Programming Guru Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 1,022 Rep Power: 6	If english is not your native language yet this forum is to be spoken in english, wouldn't be more benificial to talk in an easier way for them to understand? And as for my poor english skills i think it stems from the fact of at a young age I grew bored with it, like many things it was jsut another bit of ammunition for those evil kids to bully me over, i was far far ahead of most my class in both engish and maths when i was young (8-11) just stopped reading as much etc etc etc. And you will have a far greater grasp of the english language having a few years on me __________________ "Put your hand on a hot stove for a minute, and it seems like an hour. Sit with a pretty girl for an hour, and it seems like a minute. THAT'S relativity." - Albert Einstein

Jun 6th, 2005, 11:09 AM	#50
big_k105 PFO Founder Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Fargo, ND Posts: 1,671 Rep Power: 10	Do we really need to be discussing proper english here? I mean I personally understand the need for atleast good communication skills esp in the interview. As i have blown many interviews because i get nervious which in case i dont speak very well when im nervious. Not that im the best at proper english but im not the worst either. So again do we need to be discussing this here? __________________ BIG K aka Kyle Programming Forums Kyle K Online Please do not PM or email me programming questions. Post them in the forums instead.

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